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Episode 9: PFL And Demandbase

B2B Tonight Transcript

Ryan O'Hara:

Whoa. We are alive. What's up, Rishi?

Rishi Mathur:

How's it going, Ryan O'Hara?

Ryan O'Hara:

I don't know. We're going to let these attendees pour in. Look at this. You guys come on, stay civil. I see you all joining the Zoom. It looks like it looks like people are fighting. There's a line out the door. This is insane.

Rishi Mathur:

It's actually, down the block.

Ryan O'Hara:

It's down the block?

Rishi Mathur:

Yeah. They're selling hotdogs, it's a thing.

Ryan O'Hara:

It has nothing to do with this, it's Shake Shack. So, Rishi people are probably noticing you're in a different location this week.

Rishi Mathur:

I am.

Ryan O'Hara:

What's going on? So you left your parents' house?

Rishi Mathur:

I'm done. Done for good until next week, but I am in a new place called my girlfriend's apartment and it's fascinating.

Ryan O'Hara:

Whoa. That's exciting. Tell a little storyline while people join. Last night at around 11:30 PM. I'm in bed. I've got my onesie on ready to get some sleep and I got a little text from Rishi. I'm going to read the text to you. It says, "Can you please send me a video of how to tie a tie?" What's up with that, Rishi?

Rishi Mathur:

All right. So I haven't tied a tie in a long time. Now a lot of people are wondering, "What about the other B2B Tonights?" I have a dad and he tied all my ties. So I was confused and I asked my dad, he couldn't explain it to me. My brother doesn't want to do it. So I texted you. You're the only other person I know that ties ties.

Ryan O'Hara:

So does that mean that you see me as a father figure?

Rishi Mathur:

Mother, father, whichever one you'd like to look. I like the mother more than the-

Ryan O'Hara:

Listen. If you want to... After this episode, why don't we hop on a Zoom and we can listen to some Cat Stevens together. That sound good?

Rishi Mathur:

It sounds great.

Ryan O'Hara:

All right. So people have joined, we're getting people coming in right now. Well, we're going to kind of get started. Couple of questions. And house cleaning items for people as you join. Yes. This thing will be recorded. Yes, welcome people that came from PFL and Demandbase. Great companies, great products, great people. Some of my favorite people out there in the universe. Some other things we're going to do. Rishi, you want to talk about asking questions and stuff?

Rishi Mathur:

Yeah. I would love to, if you have any questions or concerns about Ryan's hair and tie, you could put that in the chat box and if you have any questions, put in the Q&A section, I'll be monitoring it.

Ryan O'Hara:

Just so people know too. And we'll probably interrupt a couple of times. Usually when we do B2B Tonight, the whole purpose of this is we think webinars are typically, they get kind of boring a little bit. So we try and do things a little differently here. This whole episode is themed around sales and marketing alignment. And what we want to do this week to kind of get people ready is show you some cool things you can do when you... It's not just a nice thing to say in a buzzword for a meeting, it can actually be something that your team does together for collaborating, coming up with creative ideas together, all that stuff. And we're going to kind of do a little bit of a backstory. So, last year, Rishi, I assume, you know to queue up everything right now, but last year, Rishi and I were trying to think of something cool that we could do, that would an experiment for prospecting.

Ryan O'Hara:

So we came up with this idea, what if we went out on the internet and we made a ad, but we made it just for one prospect? And we made it about the prospect instead of making it about LeadIQ. Naturally, we were like, "Oh, I know something we could do here. Why don't we get Jeremy Leveille on our team to give us a target account that he wants to break into to make the video for a re what ended up happening was we made this and the target account we did for this was Drift.

Speaker 3:

The following is an infomercial made by the team at LaedIQ in a sad attempt to prospect Drift's sales team. The branding pitch and video were strictly made without Drift's notice, consent or awareness. LeadIQ, apologizes in advance for what you're about to see. Drift did not ask us to make this. We don't blame them.

Rishi Mathur:

Hi, my name is Rishi Mathur. And boy, do I have an opportunity that will open doors for you? Do you have prospective buyers that are coming to your website, aren't converting? Are you tired of prospective buyers filling out lead forms? Do I have a solution for you? Start conversation marketing with Drift.

Speaker 4:

Before we got Drift, we had trouble getting website visitors to convert, but afterwards we grew.

Ryan O'Hara:

As a VP of Marketing, I'm constantly filling out lead forms and it makes my hands super sore. Whenever I go to a company website and I see a little Drift message, my heart skips with joy.

Rishi Mathur:

That's right, Ryan. This is your customers life when you don't use Drift, so difficult. This is your customer's life with Drift. Ah, so easy. Are your customers feeling lonely? Use Drift to help combat loneliness with great conversation? Whoa! What's this? Meet Drift bot, chat bot from the future. What's up Drift bot?

Drift bot:

[inaudible 00:04:47].

Jeremy Leveille:

Using the Drift lead bot, we increased our conversions by over 5,000,000% and now I get to keep my job. Thanks Drift.

Rishi Mathur:

No more website visitors, no more sketchy leads. And most of all, no more lead forms. With Drift, it's real conversations with real people.

Ryan O'Hara:

Grow your company with Drift today. Drift starts as low as 499 a month with 12 easy payments. To talk with a conversation specialist, visit us on the worldwide web www.Drift.com or get started with a free trial that's www.Drift.com D-R-I-F-T .com.

Rishi Mathur:

Order now.

Ryan O'Hara:

So what we did is we took that video and we posted on LinkedIn and tagged Drift on it. And started with Jeremy because Jeremy was the rep that was working on the account. As we did this, we posted it online. We tagged Drift. Instantly, just people flooded from the Drift team commenting or engaging on the post. I think it ended up getting well over 60,000 views and tons of Drift people were sharing it, but the great thing is we got... Jeremy got a direct message within five minutes from three people from the sales team two wanting to take a meeting with him. And that's the really exciting part about this thing.

Ryan O'Hara:

Jeremy, we just promoted you and obviously, so he's connecting to the audio for a second, but the Drift video basically inspired this idea that we wanted to get everyone set up in a way that you can align sales and marketing for your target accounts. You can align sales and marketing to do cool prospecting the ideas. That's sort of what the theme of today is. It's not just going to be about sales and marketing and live, but doing cool campaigns that are wrapped around your prospects and stuff.

Rishi Mathur:

That's cool. Shall we introduce our guests?

Ryan O'Hara:

Yeah, I think we should. So, you guys can unmute your webcams if you want to show your faces off, if you don't want to, if you want to hide your face it's okay. I understand. I want to hide my face whenever I'm on a chat with Rishi anyway, all the time.

Rishi Mathur:

So mean.

Ryan O'Hara:

No, no. We've got to a little bit-

Jeremy Leveille:

This one is unable to start video.

Ryan O'Hara:

Oh, we'll-

Jeremy Leveille:

You can't start your video because the host stopped it. Oh, there we go. All right.

Ryan O'Hara:

All right.

Rishi Mathur:

I guess, Jeremy, you want to start off?

Ryan O'Hara:

So everyone go around, just introduce yourselves and your roles at your companies that you work at so that people know the context of why people are talking about certain topics. Let's start with Jeremy.

Jeremy Leveille:

Okay. Yeah. Hey everybody. I'm Jeremy Leveille. I'm an account executive on our mid-market team here at LeadIQ. That's what I do. I was a BDR or SDR, whatever you want to call it, for like a year, little over a year before I moved into the role here, and I'm looking forward to jamming around some ideas and stuff that we've done here.

Ryan O'Hara:

Let's roll to Nick next. Nick, you want to say hi?

Nick Leader:

Hey, everyone. I'm an account executive at Demandbase. Prior to that, I was part of the Engagio team, which was acquired by Demandbase about 60 days ago or so, and spent almost two years on the engagement side as an account executive as well.

Ryan O'Hara:

All right, let's kick it over to Eva Jackson.

Eva Jackson:

Hi, all. I'm I'm Eva Jackson. I am the Director of Demand Generation at PFL. So I'm excited to be joined here by Craig, on the PFL team. My team is responsible for really every element of the buyer journey from customer marketing to channel marketing, webinars back when we were doing in-person events, those as well, digital marketing. So really a lot of the span the gamut of marketing programs on my team. Happy to be here.

Ryan O'Hara:

Oh, thank you. I'll will popcorn over to Craig, now. You want to talk Craig and tell people who's this guy in this call? Why does he have a voice for radio?

Craig Boas:

That's funny.

Rishi Mathur:

I already think that.

Craig Boas:

Yeah, Craig Boas. Director of Business Development at PFL. Thrilled to work with talent like Eva and our team. My team is spread out in Indianapolis and in our HQ West over in Livingston, Montana, little town, right outside of Bozeman. And yeah, we're responsible for lead gen and setting up the AEs.

Ryan O'Hara:

And lastly, but not least let's talked to Brandon Redlinger. Say hi Brandon, tell people what you do.

Brandon Redlinger:

Hey guys. Brandon Redlinger here. I'm Head of Demand Gen at Demandbase. I also came from the Engagio team. So I'm excited to join the Demandbase side and Nick and I still working together and then going out and crushing it.

Ryan O'Hara:

It's a wealthy world, they think with you too? Isn't it?

Brandon Redlinger:

Yeah.

Ryan O'Hara:

He probably will, which is good. So, to kind of kick into this a little bit, what originally started, I'm going to give you the behind the scenes on the webinar a little bit, what this plan was originally and what it turned into. So originally we had this plan basically to get everyone here, to do a prospecting campaign wrapped around the account executive, but the demand-based acquisition completely threw everything off. So we basically said, "All right, just LeadIQ. We'll do it to start with." Before we kick into the another example of working together and doing stuff with sales and marketing, I wanted to kind of figure out first, let's talk on the PFL side to start with, what are some ways that you guys work together, marketing and sales, I guess? Because Craig's got the sales perspective and Eva's got the marketing perspective. What's it like? What's the process like? Do you guys talk regularly or is it just kind of just happened on its own?

Eva Jackson:

Yeah, absolutely. Well, Craig and I are really lucky in that, marketing and BDR, BDRs roll up to marketing within the PFL work. So, we both report to our COO Nick Runyon. That, I think organically creates a lot of alignment because of, being in management meetings together. And we have a weekly meeting where we look at SQL performance. So there's a lot of natural crossover and I think even everyone moving home and working remotely has driven even more alignment than I think before, like we were already really well aligned, but, I think there's been a lot of just organic kind of conversation and collaboration that has happened with people working from home. That's across the teams, CSMs, AEs, really every department.

Ryan O'Hara:

What are some ways you guys work together?

Eva Jackson:

Do you want to speak to that, Craig?

Craig Boas:

Yeah, sure. I mean, well, we work closely, I roll up to Nick in marketing, I'm kind of like stretch Armstrong because I've got the sales side pulling me to one side. I have the marketing side pulling me to the other, some kind of that bridge in between the two groups. But yeah, Eva's group and I really, the whole marketing org really supports us with ICP, with data enrichment and just making sure that what we're calling on is ultimately going to set up the AEs, the CSMs, PFL in general, to be successful. It's every day, multiple times a day, Eva and I are in conversations. Then I'm going over working with the sales team and just really kind of the ebb and flow between the two orgs.

Ryan O'Hara:

Even at PFL who decides what target accounts the BDR team goes after? Is it marketing or is it just pulled out of nowhere or how do you guys figure it out?

Eva Jackson:

Yeah. It's a really collaborative process and Craig kind of piloted a MVP version of what we're ultimately using Engagio Demandbase for, when it comes to ICP routing. So, we have what we call and Craig can expand on it, next best account. So, all of our BDRs have a set amount of target accounts that are assigned to them each quarter. The marketing ops team kind of does that first round of assignments and kind of vetting of the accounts. And then, looking at criteria like engagement and ICP fit and existing contacts on the account, we're able to kind of prioritize those. And we've really used Engagio/Demandbase. I don't know, do you guys want me to say one or the other? Please let me know.

Ryan O'Hara:

What do you call it? What do you guys call it now? What's the rule? Do you just not say Engagio anymore?

Nick Leader:

Demandio.

Brandon Redlinger:

Demandio.

Eva Jackson:

Demandio. Got it. Cool. So, we use Demandio for routing a new list of leads. Like webinar leads or other big lists that we get from partners, to the BDRs based on ICP fit or not.

Ryan O'Hara:

Yeah. I was going to say for a second, it's kind of funny, some of you in this are probably going to get prospected by all three of our teams, don't hate us, but that routing will happen through the Demandbase team. Craig, do you guys look at only inbound leads as part of your target account list? Or will you go find people that marketing has never engaged with before?

Craig Boas:

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So, my team has got a few hundred accounts, per BDR. Our team has been as large as 24. We've had to retract a little bit, as a lot of folks have had to deal with work from home COVID-19. Just the remote workforce has allowed us to really try to really dial in better efficiencies and like everybody else, we really struggled when we went home. Because our job is lead gen. Global pandemic or not, our responsibility is to go generate leads.

Craig Boas:

So we went through a lot of different exercises with regards to new messaging and really tried to dial that in. But yeah, what we do is a lot of outbound in fact fake number, but it's probably 95% outbound, five percent inbound at this point.

Ryan O'Hara:

That's crazy. Let's get the demand-based perspective, I guess a little bit. So you too, obviously it's a little different, because you're on, you're an AE Nick.

Nick Leader:

Yeah.

Ryan O'Hara:

Going through that process. Do AEs do outbound there or do you guys kind of hang around and wait for the SDRs and take it easy?

Nick Leader:

Oh yeah, absolutely. That's a large part of my day. The collaboration aspect, I think is the best part though, because when I first started at Engagio, one of the first meetings I had was this thing called an ABM Stand up. And that was my ABM marketer, her name was Sandra, my BDR and I getting together every two weeks for half hour, 45 minutes kind of varied. And we're sitting down and collaborating on these accounts. And so, at Engagio we had territory based and we could sell up and down revenue-wise, industry-wise in that territory. So I had my patch of States. It's pretty large.

Nick Leader:

We had our ICP, our best fit based on size and industry and tech stack and stuff that we'd narrow it down to. But there's definitely hundreds if not thousands of accounts. And so my BDR and I, yes, we get inbound leads, but we strategize with marketing define two of those top tier of accounts. And then maybe if they're not even on our radar, like, yes, I'd love to have these 25 customers or companies as my customers, but are those the ones who we should be spending time with? And so that engagement metric was something that we used as a sounding off point for outbound, but it definitely is a majority, it's a majority outbound. It can't just be living and dying off the inbound lead. You'll be sitting there for awhile.

Ryan O'Hara:

For the people that are afraid of... Let's pretend that you're one of those people that's like, "I'm too deep down. I can't ask what this is." Actually it kind of reminds me a story. We had an employee that we hired and I didn't know their name and their Zoom account, they wore the team name. I did like five meetings with this person reoccurring five weeks in a row. And by the fifth week I was like, "Crap. I got to just tell them, I don't know their name yet." Even though we've done this meeting and that was really bad.

Rishi Mathur:

When he asked me for my name. I said, "Rishi." He said, "Oh, Ricky."

Ryan O'Hara:

I want to ask the Demandbase guys, can you tell us like what ABM really is? Some people probably know the term and hear it and like, "Oh, account based marketing and stuff." But what's the actual execution of that? What is it?

Nick Leader:

Looking at you Brando?

Brandon Redlinger:

Yeah. So account based to me is all about multiple teams, multiple people on your team going after multiple people on their team and they're longer deals cycles. They are larger deals and it's just a team approach. Right? So a lot of traditional demand gen is about going after individual leads. Whereas sure, we care about lead still in the account-based world, but we care more about the account first and then delivery specific relevant messaging to those people. So you're choosing the accounts first rather than a lot of times people are like, "All right, what's the new fun campaign that we're going to do?" And then like, "Let's just blast it out there. We're actually going to kinda turn that around a little bit and say all right let's actually take a look at the people who are more likely to buy, who have a high propensity to buy software like ours. And then let's create the campaigns around that."

Brandon Redlinger:

So I'm working with Nick all the time. I'm working with the SDRs all the time to figure out who are the right people to go after. And then what's the message that is most relevant to them? It's threading a lot of our campaigns together. It's not just a direct mail campaign. It's not just ABM ads. It's not just cold calling. You have to really loop all that together so that you do have a pretty cohesive experience. And then if someone comes in later in the deal cycle, a lot of times CMO comes in late. We don't want the BDR to be like, "Hey, want a demo?" They're already deep into a sales cycle. So we just need to make sure that everyone on our team knows what's happening at that account.

Ryan O'Hara:

So, on the PFL and you guys do a lot of stuff with direct mail, obviously that's like a really powerful engine here. How does that work? What inspires the idea first? Is it, "I have these target accounts. Let's send them this cool thing I found." Or is it... What's the process? How does that even happen?

Eva Jackson:

Yeah, it's a little bit of a hybrid approach. I mean, we take a similar kind of look at our target accounts and who we want to target and tear them out based on expected deal value, how many contacts we believe we'll need to engage to move a specific account forward. We also have more programmatic ABM programs that are highly based on maybe three to five contacts per account, just kind of starting to build engagement, with those organizations. And for some of those programs, we generally look at things like what focused vertical in our ICP are we targeting? What's the level of warmth within the organization? How much do we want to spend on this account? Since it's more of a scaled approach.

Eva Jackson:

So it really does vary. And Brandon your point around kind of looking at the account first and then, using that to inform for us a lot of it is direct mail, but really any element of a channel marketing strategy. So that's ads, that's landing page copy. That's really every touch that they may get. You really do have to start with what's the desired outcome for moving this account forward. So at least from the marketing perspective, that's what we're looking at.

Ryan O'Hara:

I got to ask this question, I'm sorry. What's the most expensive thing you guys have ever built?

Rishi Mathur:

Oh, my question. Let's say coolest.

Eva Jackson:

That's interesting. Craig, any thought-

Craig Boas:

From a BDR perspective or just in general?

Ryan O'Hara:

Yeah. What's like? All right, we're going to send this. All right. I'll tell you a cool story.

Rishi Mathur:

Do you guys ever send a private jet to anyone's house?

Craig Boas:

Yeah. It's on it's way, Rishi. It's on it's way.

Ryan O'Hara:

I'll tell you a story about... Our first episode of B2B Tonight, we did with Stu Heinecke and Stu Heinecke wrote a book, How to Get a Meeting with Anyone. In the book, he tells a story of a guy I actually met years ago in South Carolina, his name's Dan Walsh Mitt. Dan actually went and looked at... He wanted to get into Fortune 500 companies to do consulting for them. So Dan somehow got the connection of the guy that made all the swords for the movie Gladiator. And he had that guy makes swords with the CEO's names engraved on them.

Eva Jackson:

Oh, my goodness.

Ryan O'Hara:

And sent them to the CEOs.

Rishi Mathur:

Oh my gosh.

Ryan O'Hara:

And apparently the legend in the book is that he only didn't get a meeting with two of them. And that's because both of them didn't receive the sword, someone stole their packages. But the legend is that he had a 98% response rate or something when he did it or a 99% response rate to it. Yeah. I wish I had a sword. I'd have to wear goggles while you see, because I got to protect my eyes. But, obviously PFL hasn't said that, but what's like... Do you guys have anything that you can think of that's like, "Yeah, this was cool that we said."

Eva Jackson:

The first one that comes to mind on my end and Craig I'd be interested in your perspective, but, we had a customer once you sent as kind of a meeting maker campaign, whiskey rocks. And then if the client took the meeting, they got personalized branded, with their name on it, bottle of Woodford, which was pretty unique.

Ryan O'Hara:

Is that alcohol?

Eva Jackson:

Yes, it's alcohol.

Ryan O'Hara:

I don't-

Rishi Mathur:

Ryan doesn't drink.

Ryan O'Hara:

I don't drink. So, I don't know that stuff.

Eva Jackson:

Yeah. It's a nice whiskey.

Rishi Mathur:

Unless you're talking about Propel? He's out of the game?

Ryan O'Hara:

Hey, Propel. Proud sponsor.

Eva Jackson:

We can do that too. Branded Propel. Yeah.

Ryan O'Hara:

I drink child's soccer fuel, I guess is what they'd call it. This is what kids drink at soccer practice. So, you said that Craig was at your team that did the sending, the respondent followed up?

Craig Boas:

No.

Eva Jackson:

That was a customer of ours.

Craig Boas:

Yeah. Who did that campaign. We have kids, we have kids and we control the inventory for each BDR. So they kind of have their own, what we call swag IQ, their own little personal marketing center that they can go in and pull from. We have anything from flat mailers that are just information. We send a lot of that stuff out too, your financial services, your health insurance companies, things where they can't receive "gifts" where we also have the sock kits, that are a little bit more expensive, still kind of a good aha moment, good meeting maker. But then we also have 60, $70 mugging gummy kind of packages.

Craig Boas:

So depending on engagement and depending on who it is and what we're trying to send, who we're trying to reach, each BDR is sort of empowered to decide what they want to ship out.

Rishi Mathur:

So the other question from TJ Houston, how are you guys dealing with shipping issues related to Coronavirus and are people supplying home addresses?

Craig Boas:

Yes and yes. So, the first one was, how are we dealing with shipping issues? So, we're one of the top 10 customers in the United States for FedEx. We really have zero issues with FedEx. On occasion, we'll see a day extra delay than the normal one to two, three to four days shipping. Most of that has not been Coronavirus-related though. Most of that has been related to unrest in larger cities with different protests and things of that nature, which has slowed down some of the shipments coming into the cities, but that's minimal for us. And as far as finding home addresses, preferred mailing addresses, whatever you want to call it, remote worker addresses, we fought that early on.

Craig Boas:

I've just kind of a great story to tell, but we fought it early on and we've sort of dialed in a pretty slick way to do it and to do it efficiently per BDR.

Ryan O'Hara:

If we have to be journalists here, what is that way?

Craig Boas:

Wow.

Ryan O'Hara:

Hard to be question.

Craig Boas:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, so first I guess I'll say mid May or mid March, everybody went home, right? And just nobody knew what was going to happen. Nobody really knew what to do with the messaging should say, how much do you sell? How much do you console? It was just kind of a nightmare for all of us, I think. Eva and her team created some initial landing pages for a couple of different events, but also we made some changes. So it was a landing page for the BDR. So as we were getting communication out and updating all of our messaging, and again, sort of brute force, right? Phone calls, emails, LinkedIn messaging, pushing people to this landing page, we saw some success early and while it was success, it didn't offset what we needed as far as SQL creation.

Craig Boas:

So we had to come up with new ways. So it was more dials. It was more emails. It was literally just brute force, head through the wall. We were struggling, I think like everybody else. And then about mid May, it hit us like, "We're overthinking this. I have a team of 12 BDRs. They're sharp. They're smart folks. What if we just challenged them to go find home addresses through free online tools?" There's tons of stuff out there, family tree, something, something whitepages.com outside of names like Mike Smith or Jason Jones, things that are like, oh gosh, there's got to be a thousand of these people in every little town. Most people are identifiable through some social networking, through LinkedIn going to white pages and looking up towns and trying to figure out like, "Is this it?"

Craig Boas:

What we did is we created then sequences that would say, "Hey, Ryan, I really want you to experience PFL. We're using some third-party data appending, not sure if this is accurate, do you live at 123 main street? If not, could you let me know a better address? Because I'm assuming you're not working from the office. Let me know what you think and then either tell me directly, go to this landing page or tell me to leave you alone. Very few people were offended. Very few people were freaked out. On occasion, you'll get somebody that's like, "Don't send me anything. I don't want... You're creeping me out."

Craig Boas:

A lot of folks were like, "Yeah, that's kind of cool. I don't know how you found me, but that's... What's the secret sauce?" It's like, "Well, why don't we just have a conversation and let's talk about PFL. Let's talk about direct mail. Let's talk about how we can help you hit those 2020 goals. And oh, by the way, I got you. I'm doing what you wish your lead gen team was doing." And all we were doing is just empowering our reps to go out and find this stuff. But we would make sure that we would send that same message multiple times because you just didn't want to do like a one blast, "Hey, I'm going to send you something." You really wanted to drive some engagement because what a lot of people did, which was really kind of nice for us, "Hey, don't worry about sending me anything. I get it. Let's go ahead and have a conversation." Cheaper out, more efficient. We didn't have to wait for deliveries.

Ryan O'Hara:

I know we do have a question. Someone is asking at landing pages. We'll get to that in a second, but I wonder kind of what, before we get that question, on our end. So we did this campaign. The idea was that we were going to post five videos online to prospects, Jeremy picked the accounts, Jeremy talk about the campaign a little bit. And then we'll talk about... We ran into the same issue where we didn't know how to get home addresses and we kind of just panicked, which is one of the reasons I wanted to ask you that in this webinar. Jeremy, do you want to talk a little bit about what you did?

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah, sure. Hey, everybody. So there was... Basically we picked five target accounts and what we were planning on doing for direct mail was if they replied and they engaged back, then we would try to get an address to send something to, like if they took a meeting. Initially we were going to do combine direct mail, but also the main piece that we were going to do was a very highly customized, personalized video, for the prospect.

Jeremy Leveille:

We had done this before. So, last year we had made really highly customized, personalized videos for a certain target account and posted the videos on LinkedIn and even tagged the prospect in the LinkedIn post. We did three of them last year, all three booked meetings, and two of them are now customers. So, we had really good success with it. Obviously three is, a smaller sample size. So we were going to try it with five, this time around. When we posted them this time around though, on LinkedIn and tagged the prospect, the first one, they actually got upset because they were getting blown up with all these notifications on LinkedIn that all of these people were commenting at. The first video literally had-

Ryan O'Hara:

It was maybe the first time ever that we've done that and someone got upset.

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah.

Ryan O'Hara:

And it's okay. We actually heard it. And we were like, "Aw, crap." In the history of the campaigns of doing social videos, where we put something out and just tag the prospect, we've always put a disclaimer and we didn't this time. We didn't about doing that. We had a new process. So, I think that might've played a factor too. Rishi, do you want to actually play one of the videos?

Rishi Mathur:

Yeah, sure.

Ryan O'Hara:

But Hey Jeremy, which one did you get an op with?

Rishi Mathur:

I'm playing that one right now.

Jeremy Leveille:

Should I say the name of the company?

Ryan O'Hara:

You're going to see in the video. Yeah.

Jeremy Leveille:

We're going to see in the video anyways. So, the company is called Metacompliance and-

Rishi Mathur:

Can you guys see it?

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah.

Ryan O'Hara:

Yeah. So this is one that we did specifically for this webinar to do this experiment with people about sales and marketing linemen.

Speaker 12:

The following is the short prospecting video for the fine folks at Metacompliance. This message was created without Metacompliance's notice, consent or awareness but crafted with love by the team here at LeadIQ. And we hope to speak to you soon.

Ryan O'Hara:

LeadIQ presents a special video for Metacompliance.

Jeremy Leveille:

Oh, yes. Keith. Keith Robinson from Metacompliance. I'd like to schedule a meeting with you. We're both connected to Richard Smith from Refract one of our customers here at LeadIQ and a great champion. So definitely feel free to ask them about how many more meetings their team has booked by using our phone number, data in getting in touch with more prospects, even in the UK.

Jeremy Leveille:

Speaking of the UK, you'd like to know that here I'm based in New Hampshire, where we apparently just steal all of the town names that you folks have in the UK, including dairy and London dairy right down the street from here. So we just copy the map that you folks have when coming up with our town names. But I look forward to speaking with you soon about all of that stuff. Good day.

Ryan O'Hara:

This has been a special video for Metacompliance presented by LeadIQ. That was my voice by the way. I was the voiceover guy. How did I do?

Rishi Mathur:

You're okay. But I would like to know Jeremy did all that in one breath.

Ryan O'Hara:

He still hasn't taken a breath for a minute. Kudos by the way, to Nick, our producer for editing that too and shooting it with the zoom in and stuff.

Rishi Mathur:

Nick, right now is eating a burrito. But when he comes back to us.

Ryan O'Hara:

So, the original scheme was going to be to make the video. If they don't respond, send a package to them. And if they do respond to send the package of them anyway. So now that we know how to get home addresses, we're going to have to go do that, which I'm really excited about. Someone did ask in the chat, what do you guys use for landing page technology so that you can ask for a home address and stuff?

Rishi Mathur:

Hold on. It was actually directed to Eva first, so lets ask her and then we'll go around.

Ryan O'Hara:

Okay.

Eva Jackson:

Because I'm such an expert on landing pages, just kidding. We use Marketo and I think that really any landing page creation software, is suitable for capturing preferred address. I think it's the more important thing that we've paid attention to, at PFL and we kind of couple the BDRs, very direct approach with research, which candidly, I was very skeptical and Craig knows this. I was like, people are going to get mad. I just figured that people just based on past experience would be really salty about getting things at home, but it's actually surprised me, which is awesome and a huge learning for us.

Eva Jackson:

So, we kind coupled that direct approach with more automated programs to capture for preferred address. So, email streams or webinars is a really great tactic for us to use, to capture preferred address. And really, the more important thing is just making sure when you do that capture, in a landing page that you're very clear about how that data is going to be used. That's the biggest kind of tip that we've understood is, you have to make sure it's very clearly stated that you're only going to use it one time or if you want it to be used more than once, making sure that opt-in language is super clear. So, that's been the big kind of important tactic on our end to kind of couple with the BDR outreach.

Craig Boas:

Yeah. Sorry to interrupt you. But we put that in the initial language, like, Hey, we think this is your address. Could you verify a force by the way. If it is, we're not going to house it in our CRM, we're just going to use it one time. What we're trying to do is break through the digital clutter, give you a moment, have you experience PFL and while Eva was nervous, you've got to go back now. Was it nine, 10 weeks? The willingness now from prospects, as we learn this new norm, people are more willing to just say like, yeah-

Eva Jackson:

Yeah, totally.

Craig Boas:

I used to have an office, now I don't. I'm in my guest bedroom. So yeah, that works. Just don't house it, don't solicit to me other ways, just be cool. And Jeremy, back to you, I know you were talking about you were just testing with five. I wanted to put some context around what I was talking about from that sort of brute force, what we were doing initially. And then we piloted using those free online tools. I just wanted to give sort of the panel here some understanding. We had put 2000 people from mid-March through mid May through some sort of email phone call, LinkedIn cadence. We piloted 300 people using a whitepages.com approach.

Craig Boas:

We converted one percent of our 2000 and with the 300 people, yeah, 300 prospects, we converted 10%. So we made 30 appointments on this 300 compared to the 20 appointments on the 2000s. So mathematically 300 is not greater than 2000, but it was, and the difference was we were sending direct mail and people were impressed.

Ryan O'Hara:

So, I'm going to get the demand-based perspective on this. So you guys saw Jeremy's Metacompliance video. Talk to us if you were coming to an organization like LeadIQ, I don't know if it's going to be Nick or Brandon, you guys can drop paper scissors or something, but what's the play? How do we get the awesome, cool content that Jeremy made to align with the marketing team? How do we get it played with the marketing team? How do we actually take that video and get it to Metacompliance, so people can see it, besides just cold email and cold outreaches or other stuff that you can do?

Nick Leader:

Go ahead, Brandon.

Brandon Redlinger:

Good question.

Nick Leader:

I'll tell you, one of my favorite campaigns that we did, which might be kind of an interesting idea, and it was a good story of how marketing and sales collaborated. So there's a summit, this TOPO Summit, which I'm sure all you guys have heard of had been to, and Craig Rosenberg and Brandon are good buddies. They do a lot of content together. So we created a fat head, standup cardboard cutout of Craig Rosenberg. And we put it on our booth, next to our booth. And everyone was coming by and taking pictures. And Craig came over and put his arm around himself and shared it on social media. And it got a ton of traffic and a ton of awareness. What we did for serious decisions, Brandon and I had this idea, it was this campaign called #find your face.

Nick Leader:

And so there was so much interest generated from that little cardboard cutout of Craig that we decided to say, "How can we spin this up to improve upon that, but scale it a little bit? Because it's not just Craig to like our prospects." And so, there's four of us going to serious decisions on the rep side. And so we each picked five prospects. We just took their big brand. It was like their LinkedIn photo or something like that. And we sent that to get printed and we put their faces. It was kind of like the size of a basketball, maybe, obviously flat. And we put it all over our booths at serious decisions and people are walking by and they were like, "Why is my face on your booth?" And it's like, "You're the exact person I wanted to talk to." We had, so there's 20 faces, 20 people, all 20 of them stopped by.

Nick Leader:

Two people didn't like it. One person really didn't like it. The other person was like, "This is weird. Can you please take this down?" But nice try kind of thing. But the other 18, we booked meetings with all 18 of those companies. We closed for those deals and they were all CMOs or VPs of top tier accounts for us. That was probably one of my favorite things that we did at Engagio.

Brandon Redlinger:

Yeah. 100%. I love that one so much because, you don't actually know if a lot of those people are going to serious, but you know they have people there. So we had a ton of people who were like, "Hey, that's my boss. Can I take that and take a picture with my boss?" So they're taking that and they either tweeting it out or they're just sending an email directly to their boss. And then the other piece of that was yeah, we took a picture of the booth where we had all the faces up there and just said, "Can you find your face?" And on the back of them, we said, "You either win $25 gift card or could win some nice beats had headphones."

Brandon Redlinger:

So they actually had incentive to come by. And then we tagged them on social. We even did follow up emails. "Hey, it's the last day. Last chance to come find your face and potentially win some headphones." So that campaign killed it for us. Again, best part, they didn't even have to be there. They had a lot of people who just thought it was a fun campaign who then took pictures of it, shared it, spread like wildfire in their own company.

Nick Leader:

I think the human aspect, and now more than ever, we've probably realized that like the last five months or whatever, but you just have to be like, "Look, I really want to talk to you." You're probably getting a hundred emails a day from people wanting your time. I'm going to think outside the box to get it in a fun way. It's like, yeah, I put your face on my booth. Joke about it. Be cool. Thinking in that human type of way and trying to connect with someone. I think people at least appreciate the effort anyways. "It took a lot of time to put your face on this booth. I spent a lot of time trying to find good pictures of you... And like we sent your face out to get printed and-

Brandon Redlinger:

Print it out, then cut those out.

Nick Leader:

We cut them out, yeah.

Brandon Redlinger:

But we had the paint stir sticks that we glued them to the back of, and then put it on our... It was a lot of work, but it was very effective.

Ryan O'Hara:

One of the ways that we promoted Jeremy's video was he posted on his account, but we'd also posted on the LeadIQ social accounts. What we did is I'm not trying to plug our product. You can use a competitor. I don't care.

Brandon Redlinger:

You do care. You do care.

Rishi Mathur:

Hold on, we don't care.

Ryan O'Hara:

All right, listen. That's neither here or there. But what we did is we took a list of people that worked at these different companies. And we captured them from LinkedIn sales navigator with their titles and the function being sales. And I built a really quick list of all these people. One of the things that we can do, you can do it too, but it's a little bit more customized. We didn't just get their work emails. We also got their personal emails and we took that information, threw it into a CSV and we uploaded that onto social for a target audience and built the target audience for it. So that anyone that was at Metacompliance was also seeing on Facebook, a video for Metacompliance.

Ryan O'Hara:

On LinkedIn, we promoted. On Facebook, we promoted the post, primarily because we had a lot of engagement with the post. On LinkedIn, we promoted it right to the company. The actual response came from Jeremy, emailing them afterward. Wasn't it Jeremy? DM-ing them after or how did they actually get the meeting-

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah. Because, basically as I was explaining earlier, we had one person that they got upset that they were getting all these notifications and then the second one that we posted on LinkedIn, he didn't get upset, but this other company, he just removed the tag. He just clicked in LinkedIn to un-tag himself from that post. So we were like, "Okay, over to here." And then, so for the remaining three videos, I just emailed them. I just emailed them the videos and one of those three was Metacompliance. So he replied to the email and he was like, "Jeremy, I think you might be crazy, but this is awesome. I just emailed this video to our entire sales org and let's schedule a call for next week." It's a highly qualified opportunity in the pipeline now.

Jeremy Leveille:

There was another video I sent somebody else. Similar type of response that they got, one where the guy replied back, he was like, "I sent them a guitar video." Or, "I'm playing guitar a guitar." I don't even know how to play the guitar. I was like-

Ryan O'Hara:

It's maybe the worst thing in the world that anyone in this room could watch. It's terrible. It's so good, that it's bad. It's so bad, that it's good.

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah. [crosstalk 00:42:19] is VP of Sales Strategy and Operations. He was like, "This video is..." I don't know, can I swear?

Ryan O'Hara:

Yeah.

Jeremy Leveille:

He said, "This video is hilarious." And he sent it to his whole sales org. They're now a customer of ours. Somebody else replied to one of my guitar videos and they said, "Jeremy, I don't know. I think you might be crazy, but I saw this video and I thought you might be crazy, but I have to meet this guy. I have to meet with him." And she scheduled the call and that converted into a customer as well.

Ryan O'Hara:

By the way we did, for people that are wondering, we surveyed all of our LeadIQ customers. We do a lot of cool stuff like this with experiments of prospecting, with marketing and sales, helping each other. We emailed our customers last year and did a survey on how they heard about LeadIQ. Literally some of these videos that Jeremy put, I think we had over 15% of our customers have heard of us from Jeremy, just doing these things and getting buzz and doing this. If you're this company-

Jeremy Leveille:

I have to ask for a raise now, after we get off this webinar.

Ryan O'Hara:

If you really put your AEs front and center, think about from this perspective, who's better at talking than Nick and Jeremy and Craig on this? I'm bumbling around trying to figure it out. Rishi's literally doing something else right now. He's doing Sudoku puzzle.

Rishi Mathur:

I'm playing Asteroids. But I got to do a Sudoku Puzzle. I can't play Asteroids. I can't-

Ryan O'Hara:

Your reps are literally talented talkers that are meant to be in these things. And you should get your reps to do these things, to have them be on webinars, have them participate in stuff. It's one of the things I really actually like about Demandbase too. I went to a dinner at Dreamforce a couple of years ago from you guys and got a free, I know it was before when you guys had worked there, but got a steak dinner, hung out and talked to people. And the speaker that came up and talked to everyone, wasn't a VP. It was literally an account executive. And I loved that. I was like, "That's so great that they did something like that with field marketing." Rishi, do you want to tackle some of the questions?

Rishi Mathur:

Yeah. We got a couple of questions here. This one's from [Harget Sink 00:44:16]. And this was I think for Craig earlier, how did you figure out those ABM accounts? Were they SALs or MQLs?

Craig Boas:

That's a good question. So really they started out just as simply, ICP fit. We just looked at the macro list and said, "Okay, what do our best customers look like? How do we go find more of them?" And literally scraped for size, revenue, tech stack vertical. Then we compress down from there and build campaigns around mainly industry. So, really the MQL comes after it's all built, right? And after we start prospecting.

Nick Leader:

I think going off that, going off of that point, when I think about ABM, it's going to get the people, going to get in front of the people who you want to talk to. Because in reality, of course I would love to talk to this Chief Marketing Officer of every one of my prospects, but that's not going to happen. Those guys aren't just casually browsing your websites or popping into a webinar, unfortunately. And so you have to build the story of all of these little pieces, even if it's pre-MQL, things that happen that wouldn't qualify a lead, like someone came to engagio.com and then left. That's all they did.

Nick Leader:

I'm going to follow up on that, but I'm going to use that person who might be a manager or director to then go email the CMO or the VP about what we do and why we do it well and stuff like that. So I think to Craig's point, it is about finding the ICP fit and then go get those people. Because they're not likely going to come to you, most of the time, anyways, unfortunately.

Ryan O'Hara:

On our end one of the things that we recently implemented was we built lead grades and grades are different than lead scores. It's basically a criteria of things that don't change. So a lead comes in, your head count is not going to change that much. Your annual revenue is not going to change that much. Your title very rarely changes. Your function doesn't change. Those are different things that will go into a lead grade for us. And we have separate workflows based on the lead grade that comes in. That will trigger us and if we see something come in a trigger, like it upsets us, I guess, that will trigger us. And if we see something come in that has a good lead grade, that becomes a priority for us to put something together.

Ryan O'Hara:

One of the things we don't do yet, and I'm sure it sounds like PFL is really good at this, by the way, with your weekly meetings that you guys do, we don't really get together in jam and say, "How do we break into these accounts?" We used to, it was easier when we were all in one office, but since we've gotten remote, I definitely think we've gotten siloed. It sounds like that's an effective strategy here.

Ryan O'Hara:

So if you're looking for a takeaway of that, get with your team and do a weekly brief on, these are some five... These are five accounts we want to break into. What can we do? We did that with Jeremy for this webinar, but if we weren't doing this webinar, Jeremy, I don't even know if that conversation would have ever happened. Right?

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah. Maybe not.

Ryan O'Hara:

It makes me sad. What are the other questions? Someone asks, "What's your favorite item to ship?" Jeremy actually has a really cool story. Do you want to share the story Jeremy, about the guy that got married?

Jeremy Leveille:

That sounds weird.

Ryan O'Hara:

Oh, yeah.

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah. I don't even know where I would go with that one, but I'll leave the comedy to you, Rishi. I mean, I have a few things that I could talk about there. One was a cutting board, so, this prospect before being able to take a meeting, their VP of sales was on his honeymoon. And so, I was like, "Maybe a wedding gift without being weird." And so, I thought maybe a cutting board, that's something you might get somebody as a wedding gift. And so I found one that... This person's last name is O'Reilly so very Irish. And there was a cutting board that I found that you can inscribe it with the person's last name, you just type in their last name, it'll be on the cutting board. And the I in O'Reilly had an Irish clover.

Jeremy Leveille:

So that was like, I think 40 bucks, but it turned into like a $20,000 deal for us. So that was one. And then, I had a few prospects that I noticed, literally all at the same time. I was like, "Whoa, what's going on here with all the babies being made?" Because all of a sudden people were out of office for paternity leave or maternity leave or any other, those other entities. And so, my fiance is very crafty. She's not in sales, but she does like arts and crafts and stuff, as a hobby. And so she made onesies. Sometimes she'll make personalize, customize onesies for people with like something that she puts on the onesie that's like, whatever. I don't know how she does it, but... So we put the company's logo. We took that, we did it for I think, three or four accounts and put the company's logo on the onesie and then like a little subtle LeadIQ tiny logo here on the shoulder. And it was on a baby onesie and mailed those out to the prospects.

Jeremy Leveille:

I'm pretty sure, like all of those converted to meetings, all four of them and one of those people even posted it on LinkedIn. They took a picture of the onesie and they posted it on LinkedIn. They're like, "Oh my God, this is so cool. This is what all SDR should be doing." Because at the time I was in SDR. So yeah, that's a couple of cool stories.

Nick Leader:

Brandon and I do that a lot. The onesies. That's a good one.

Jeremy Leveille:

You already knew about it before.

Nick Leader:

We do that. We standardize those.

Jeremy Leveille:

Because I've talked about it on the other podcasts and webinars. And you may have, saw the LinkedIn post, but yeah, you may have done it dor me.

Nick Leader:

Yeah. The onesies are awesome. I think the best gifts are always the personal ones. I can talk for a long time for those, but a good standard mass personalization is we do print the... Our mascot at Engagio was a whale named Geo and it was kind of this cartoon middle guy. So we made a baby. His name is Geo because whales, I guess, are in pods and our mascot's name, anyways.

Nick Leader:

So yeah, we put this little baby Geo on this onesie and we had blue ones and pink ones. And so to that point, customers prospects, whatever door opener, or like just a, "Hey checking in, congrats on the newborn." That was something that we could kind of order in mass, so to speak and still make it feel like it's personal. So we didn't take it as far as you did, with their prospect's logo on the front. We did the Engagio logo, but that worked all the time. People are super appreciative of that.

Rishi Mathur:

I like the respirators and put LeadIQ logos on them and just send them out to everybody.

Nick Leader:

I wonder if anyone's done that.

Ryan O'Hara:

What were you to say, Eva?

Eva Jackson:

It's just notable to me through all these conversations around the item, that it really isn't about what the item is. It's about that personal kind of effort that went into identifying what this person cares about at the time. And how do you use that to create a brand connection or speak to the pain that they're looking for? Nick, you mentioned it's all about kind of creating those human connections right now, and that's definitely more true than ever.

Eva Jackson:

So, I think we all have favorite items, but, and I can nerd out about items in a box all day being. Integrating direct mail into a lot of our programs, but it really is all about that message and informing that human connection with the person.

Craig Boas:

Yeah. And just when you, talking about 2000 people being prospects, I mean, we're prospecting hundreds a week, new people putting them in long sequences and trying to drop orchestrated mail in there. It really isn't about the thing. It's about the experience. We personalize the car that's inside the box that has the same pair of socks that we have thousands that are being shipped out, over the course of year. What is cool for us is because we work so closely with FedEx, the minute we find out that the box has been delivered, not the minute, but within 15 minutes of the box being delivered, my BDRs get a notification from FedEx saying, "Hey, Rishi just got his box. Boom." Now you're on the phone going, "Hey, I'm the guy that sent you the thing." And it's like, wow, that's the orchestration. That's that memorable, very personalized, very hyper-targeted, which is part of what we sell.

Jeremy Leveille:

Yeah. One question I have on that though is... And I have this question too, sometimes when I do direct mail and have stuff delivered to people, I'll sometimes wait, because is it... And you might, you probably know better. Because if you work really closely with FedEx, that package was delivered, but maybe that person wasn't home, or is it, you only do that if it's the type of package where they have to sign it. So they signed off on the package. So you know, physically, they were holding that package. Because sometimes if I don't know that, I have some delivered, I get the email saying that, that thing was delivered. I'll usually wait a day or two. Because maybe they're not home or something. And then I call them and they're like, "What are you talking about? I didn't get that." And they might not get it for a couple of days. So what do you guys do with that?

Craig Boas:

It's different working from home versus working in an office.

Eva Jackson:

I agree.

Craig Boas:

In an office, a lot of times people will say, "I didn't get anything." You don't want to argue, "Well, I got a notification. You're lying." It's that it's sitting in a mail room and it'll be there in a day or two, or "Hey, I'm out of the office, but it's probably on my desk. I'll see in a couple of days." Those are the conversations that we've had historically. Now, when they say, I don't know what you're talking about. It's like, "Well, go check your front door and call me back." Or, "Go check front door. I'll call you in 10 minutes." The timeliness for us is actually really part of the aha moment. Like, "Whoa, should I be creeped out? Or is that just technology at its finest?" And that's really what we try to leverage is, don't wait a day or two, the novelty is wearing off. That moment in time is wearing off. So we're like, drop what you're doing and make the dial.

Eva Jackson:

I think we're all lucky too, that we were, everyone on this call markets to marketers in some way. And I think because we are trying to find those innovative approach as we're probably the least skeptical group of people you could reach out to because we're like, "Oh, we see what you're doing. All right. I'll buy it. Tell me more."

Nick Leader:

People are like, "I'm adopting this."

Eva Jackson:

Right.

Nick Leader:

Like a onesie, right? People are like, "I'm doing this now. Thank you." It's like, "Okay."

Rishi Mathur:

So I don't mean to be that guy, but I'm going to be, we have five more minutes, on this webinar.

Jeremy Leveille:

[inaudible 00:54:51], Rishi.

Ryan O'Hara:

You are that guy. If people have questions, if you want to ask questions to the fine panel that we've put together today. We basically have put together the cast of friends getting back together. I don't know why this doesn't have more people in it.

Rishi Mathur:

To be honest, that's who Craig looks like, Chandler. Oh my God. It makes so much sense.

Ryan O'Hara:

That's so weird. Here's what I was going to say too. So we talked about alignment. We've talked about doing things together. We talked about getting your sales talent in front of your customers and using them also for marketing tactics as well. What's the foundational reason you guys think that sales and marketing have problems? Why is this happening? All these companies? Because, we have a lot of people that came to this webinar today that want to know this stuff. This is a big problem. What starts it? Is it just this preconceived stigmatism toward each other? I don't know stigmatism, that's an I thing, but stigma against someone, how does it happen and how do we fix it? Because, that's really the big takeaway we want people to have today.

Brandon Redlinger:

I feel like the biggest thing is the golden comped on different things, right? What motivates people more than money? Not too many things. A rep is paid to close deals, a lot of times marketers are paid to get more leads. They are measured on how many downloads they got from the ebook. Not necessarily do those people actually matter or are they be part of our SAPs? Are they targeted accounts? So I think one thing that has worked well at Engagio and at Demandbase now too, is just like Nick knows that I look at of the people who download my ebook, how many people are on my target account? And of those target accounts, how many people are within the ICP. So he knows that it's going to be a solid pipeline. So, I'm always looking at, "Are they quality?" It's not a quantity game. Sure. It feels good to hit a thousand downloads in a day or two, but I care more about, are they the right people?

Ryan O'Hara:

Pretty good to brag that you had a thousand downloads? The things I do for a thousand downloads, I just get really sad gravelly.

Craig Boas:

I would go maybe, you brought up comp and something like that. I think business philosophy has a lot to do with it as well because that can influence trust. So when I look at my past, where I've been and the departments I've worked with, you kind of look at, what can I control? And do I really want to give that up to someone else who might not be compensated and or have the same KPIs that I have? And so can I trust this person? Luckily when I joined PFL, everything was kind of out on the table and it was like, "This is what we do. And this is how we work." And it's a very tiered approach and it's very much a, you have to trust your brothers and sisters in this group and in that group, and you've got to be a conduit and you actually just, everybody has to work together. And if you don't have that trust really PFL is not a good place for you. And so I knew that coming in.

Ryan O'Hara:

I think one thing that I'm kind of realizing that has helped me a lot. We've grown a lot in the past two years, we've grown 6X and I literally get in meetings now with people I don't know and don't know what's going on. The other day I thought I was talking to a vendor and it was someone that was on a different team. We were sending up all our security stuff and had to go with one of the IT people and I didn't know. I think you need to make time for sales, if you're in marketing. And if you're in sales, you need to make time for marketing.

Ryan O'Hara:

That's one of the most basic things. Have the marketers come to an SDR stand up once a week, have the sales reps meet with the marketing leaders once a week. Have marketing leaders meet with sales leaders once a week. I think the problem is, we're also busy and head down on getting things done with our own goals and OKRs and stuff that we don't actually make time for each other anymore. And then you get on a meeting and you shrug and don't know what to talk about.

Ryan O'Hara:

That meeting's important, even if it's just on a human level, dealing with stuff. I think we need to just open up with each other. My sales leader, Tyler and our team should be like a therapist to me and I should be his therapist a little bit. I've got father issues. I could talk about these things with him. No, all kidding aside though and I know Rishi has deep seated fathers issues. That's why he asked me how to tie his tie. It really is important to make time for each other. I think that's a really important thing here too.

Craig Boas:

Well, Ryan, I'll just give you a sort of an exclamation point to that statement. Our VP of Sales just sent Eva and I a message. He has to hop off, he's been listening. So, just right there alone, we are being supported in this effort, by our VP of sales, the guy who I spend a ton of time with... That's the other side of the stretch Armstrong, right? I'm with Eva for a good portion of day. And then with Steve in the other portion of day. That's exactly right. You've got to spend time with each other. And that of course helps build trust.

Ryan O'Hara:

Jeremy's just looking up on LinkedIn, who he is so he can prospect him. I know what you're doing. I can see your eyes, Jeremy. Cool it. Okay. Let's do final closing thoughts for everyone then we'll we'll wind down. Does anyone have anything else to add?

Nick Leader:

I think that collaboration piece working towards the same goal, that's really what should matter. We're trying to achieve this, whatever it is, go make the company public, get sold, hit this revenue threshold, generate this many meetings. We have to be working towards the same goal or else. And it has to be coming from the top down or else that collaboration piece and that alignment piece is never going to work. It has to be an org-wide thing. I think that's what I've learned and appreciated most the last two years and being in the ABM space, but one of the vendors is, it's all about getting to trust the people you work with.

Ryan O'Hara:

Jeremy Ross makes a good point. So sometimes the C-level shift is best way to solidify the school. CRO should oversee marketing and sales. That's actually a really popular trend happening now, is CMOs are going away and people are just having them move into CRO roles instead.

Nick Leader:

Totally.

Ryan O'Hara:

Well, thank you everyone for listening. We had a great episode today. PFL Demandbase everybody in this crew. You guys are awesome. Thank you so much. Congrats on the acquisition Brandon and Nick, even Craig, congrats on all your success to. PFL's obviously killing it. A lot of people talk about them all the time and you guys are the... You're a company I look up to. I don't want to make you all bashful and stuff, but I like what you guys are doing. Jeremy, thank you for coming on, I guess. Rishi, you're cool too. Thank you everyone. We'll be contacting you-

Brandon Redlinger:

Yeah. Thanks, everyone.

Ryan O'Hara:

There'll be a recording sent to everyone and thank you very much. Take it easy.